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Author Topic: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.  (Read 9053 times)

Offline Big Kid

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Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« on: March 03, 2016, 03:26:52 PM »
I've seen both play HS ball in State Regionals, unfortunately both played against less than stellar competition in those games. The similarities are both play or played for high level CPS schools that had COMPLETE teams. Te similarities don't end there but I think they point a little upward for Gage.

I saw Jr. A few years ago in the Julian Regional (my daughter dated AT THE TIME A KID ON ST LAURENCE). MP played Julian in the first game and won handily. Jr. Played about a half the game and did a great job scoring when the defense collapsed inside with his open 3's, had good court awareness when the D came out and either distributed down low or took it to the rim and scored when the lane was totally open. Against the competition his limited first step helped him get to the basket.

Laurence wins their game and are predominately white and slow (insert Trump racial references). Jr. Does the same thing he did against Julian and MP wins handily. Laurence was outmanned and lost big time. The HS Gsme is only 32 minutes and I saw Garrett play maybe 18 minutes on average in those 2 games. He was a 4*.

I live close to Curie and have seen Gage a few times but against weaker competition where he didn't have to do a whole lot. Saw him last this past Tuesday against Lane. They beat Lane by 50. He played around 16-20 minutes, I believe scored in double figures, distributed and played good D. Prior to that much of the same.

What I will say about both is I think Gage is ultimately the better talent but not by huge margins. His first step is quick but not Ulis quick, his shot is decent. His on court awareness is above average (decent IQ). His lateral movement was better than Jr. Meaning he will stay with his guy much better on the perimeter. Plus, not knowing then what I do now, Gage has no medical issue that will limit him.

If Jr. Was a 4* then Gage at this point is at least a high 3* if not a 4 based on comparison. The biggest thing is I think Gage will end up having a better career when all is said and done.

With all that Gage is not coming in changing this team his first or even second year IMHO. Much like Jr., he's a good facilitator and plays better when playing with equal talent.

Offline John92

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2016, 07:25:01 AM »
Thanks for the info BK.  Gage will be a nice player to round out the team.

Offline VUWildcat2103

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2016, 08:22:47 AM »
Appreciate the insight, but Garrett was Big East Freshman of the Year. I do not see Gage coming close to that, and suspect that the expectations of him from the fanbase will continue to grow, unwarranted in my opinion.

Offline lake county fan

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2016, 01:58:43 PM »
I have seen Gage play 3 games on tv he is good but I think Jr was better his sr year in high school but he never got much better

Offline DPU70

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2016, 07:02:30 PM »
This is a key point.  Gage has an upside, where Jr has regressed.  Jr went from FOY to maybe 6th PG in the league.  Maybe 7th if I consider the kid from Creighton.  Or 8th, if I take both Archi and Brunson from Nova.

Offline mrap24

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2016, 10:12:35 PM »
This is a key point.  Gage has an upside, where Jr has regressed.  Jr went from FOY to maybe 6th PG in the league.  Maybe 7th if I consider the kid from Creighton.  Or 8th, if I take both Archi and Brunson from Nova.

when BGJR was a SR in HS he had an upside too and he is still scoring 13+ per game.  lets not act like he is some 5 ppg scrub. 

Gage might be good but to say he has upside and BGJR didnt is silly.  BGJR was a MUCH MUCH MUCH better HS player than Gage was and it isnt even close.  comparing a 4* to a guy ranked 200ish.  come on

Offline John92

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2016, 07:19:03 AM »
I think BGJR's illness has increasingly negatively impacted his play over the years.

That said, I think Gage will be a nice recruit. Not a star but someone that can be a solid player after a freshman year of learning pains and adjustment.

Offline mrap24

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2016, 07:48:16 AM »
Agree John. Gage will be a nice player, will develop but will have many ups and downs, as freshman do. However the way people talk, you'd think he have the next coming of Carmelo Anthony coming in. Expecting instant major impact isn't a smart idea. He will need a couple years

Offline lake county fan

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2016, 07:49:55 AM »
I agree on BG health problems and the upside Gage has but a lot depends on his actions

Offline VUWildcat2103

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2016, 08:11:12 AM »
Agree John. Gage will be a nice player, will develop but will have many ups and downs, as freshman do. However the way people talk, you'd think he have the next coming of Carmelo Anthony coming in. Expecting instant major impact isn't a smart idea. He will need a couple years
Second this. Each year, the message boards have comments that the incoming class is an improvement over what we have and how x recruit was a steal.

Offline mrap24

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2016, 08:49:54 AM »
yeah for sure jive.  what got me, and i am not picking on anyone, was the comment that Gage has upside and BGJR has regressed.  you cant compare an guy who is a jr in college vs a SR is HS.  Yes we know what BGJR is but we have no clue what Gage will be in the BE.  Remember how Gazi was supposed to come and be good?  how'd that work out?    All i am saying is when BGJR was a SR in HS, he was WAY better than gage.  to compare them in insulting to BGJR, and i am far from a BGJR defender.  you cant even compare them in HS b/c BG wins every day of the week and twice on sunday

Offline VUWildcat2103

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2016, 08:59:14 AM »
I have been called a Garrett hater by more than a few people, and I have been clearly defending him. I would really like to know why we set such expectations on players with flaws? Do I think Gage will be solid? Yes. Do I think he will be a DePaul great? No. Could he have a Jamee Crockett type career? Perhaps.

We already had the Garrett vs. Cain comparison, and Cain is getting all the love. I'd like to revisit it in 2 years and see if he is as beloved.

Offline mrap24

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2016, 09:04:28 AM »
i am very curious to see how Cain does next year when he becomes a marked man and his usage greatly increases.

getting a lot of love over his 1 made 3 pointer per game like he's steph curry.  shoot 43% on 6 attempts per game and i am sold.  43% on 2.5 per game, keep it

Offline Big Kid

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2016, 12:18:14 PM »
I saw both play as Seniors on more than 2 occasions and I saw enough similarities between the two to make the post. Plus there is only 3 years separating their senior years, committed to same college and basically playing the same position, plenty of relevance.

First, everyone is entitled to their opinion. Second there is no way Garrret is Waaay better than Gage. I'm not sure he is even better despite rankings. Garrett played with one of the most complete HS basketball teams I've seen in a while on the 2013 MPHS champion team. You had Josh Cunningham, Xzavier Taylor, Kyle Davis, Markell Johnson. So much talent and so manny options. Garrett played great within the system of a very good team. He played on a great AAU team as well. He is a very good system player and knows his role in that system. On either team he did not have to do too much as he had plenty of talent surrounding him. I had concerns about that made posted them at the time. DePaul was a far from complete basketball team when he was coming in. He was just not the type of player that could take over a game in my opinion and we needed someone who would step up and take over games if need be. People looked at his rating and assumed he would come in and be that guy. Maybe in the end he was overrated. Everyone on good teams look better than they possibly are especially when playing on real good, complete teams.

Second, BE Freshmen of the Year really doesn't mean anything to me (see Melvin, Cleveland). Any freshmen of merit playing at De Paul has the opportunity to put up stats that can win you that award. Both are latest BEFOY (Melvin and Jr.) either stagnated at best or regressed at worst. If a kid really wanted that award they would commit here in. A heart beat.

My observation saw a lot of similarities. Having a Garret kind of career up to this point from Gage, when he gets in his Jr. Year, given his rating, would be nice and I potentially think he could be better especially on the defensive end. Kyle Davis always defended the better perimeter threat on MP, Gage defends the better perimeter player against Curie. Gage has some very good games against solid competition so his talent cannot be dismissed. I'm not saying nor do I say in my original post that Gage is going to come and take over this team and games. If you believe after three years of college behind him, that Garrett is still a 4* type player than we may have an underrated find in Gage. If you feel that Garrett has regressed in stature since HS (like me), then when Jr. leaves, whether if it's after this year or next, we have a kid that can race that productivity. We haven't won squat with Jr so won't say Gage will make us better or greater. But if we can recruit better and some other guys develop and advance quickly than we have a nice complimentary piece to the puzzle. Only time will tell.

Offline VUWildcat2103

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2016, 01:02:00 PM »
I agree that Gage can be a complementary player, however when the comparison is to a player who is discussed as one of DePaul's better players the past 5 years, it will be met with a raised eyebrow. Where I believe Garrett suffered was very much the same point I am trying to argue against; expectations and role as a freshman. Garrett never should have been put in a place where he was to be an impact freshman, but he was. So I worry that people will do the same to Gage. Both need time to get acclimated to college basketball, but it did not happen with Garrett. He has carried the weight of being the focus of this program almost from day 1.

Offline mrap24

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2016, 02:58:18 PM »
Jive, i dont agree with your statement that BGJR was required to be the focal point right away.  remember, Melvin and Young were here, and even on a bad team, those guys put up a ton of numbers.  Billy was option #3 his frosh year and averages 12/3/3.

As for gage, assuming everyone stays, he will be AT BEST (which is really pushing it as well) the 5th option behind BG, Eli, TH4, Wood.  I also highly doubt Gage plays 29 mpg like Bg did as a frosh.  I do think gage can be good in time, bu i caution anyone who thinks he is going to come in and make an immediate impact.  i just dont see it happening

Offline VUWildcat2103

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #16 on: March 09, 2016, 03:03:46 PM »
Mrap - he was asked to play 30 minutes a game. He was the new face of the program. He was asked to do a lot in his freshman year.

Offline Big Kid

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #17 on: March 09, 2016, 03:35:07 PM »
We also didn't have the depth at the Guard position when Garrett was a Frosh that we have coming back (assuming everyone does). So I don't expect Gage to play anywhere near where Jr was 3 years ago.  Or put up his numbers. Here's hoping he doesn't as that would mean Cain, Wood, Garrett, Gazi we're all playing well. My point was I do see similarities in their HS game, several to be honest. I see Gage getting 10 minutes and depending on the rotation is going or not getting more as the season wears on. And I think in time Gage, with hindsight on my side relative of Garrett of course, that Gage may end up being better. That's assuming he has the drive to want to and somehow this staff can assist him in that endeavor as well. A lot of assuming.

At the end of the day, I like what I've seen from Gage not LOVE as I think he's a decent recruit that over time can turn into a nice player for us.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2016, 03:41:03 PM by Big Kid »

Offline Big Kid

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Re: Gage vs. Garrett Jr.
« Reply #18 on: March 20, 2016, 11:35:37 AM »
One more comparison, they won State Championships as Seniors. Again, while Jr may have been BE Frosh of the year, he wasn't a game changer. Stats is all that won him that award. Gage will not be that, unless he plays ludicrous minutes but Gage was the definitive leader of his team where Jr played second fiddle to Cunningham and at times Davis.

 


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